If Kyle Boller had to start

[Sports Steve]

If Kyle Boller was forced to start the rest of the season as QB do you think he could carry this team to the playoffs after his 3 TD performance when McNair went down last game ?

:jester: :jester:

[Ravenatic20]

First, wrong thread; but I don't really care.
Second, I don't think he was all that his stats showed him to be. Two of his TD's could have easily been TD's for the other team. At the same time he did move the ball down the filed. To answer your question, yes, I think he can. He has a winning record, and if we win more than we drop from now on out, we should be in the playoffs.

[Sports Steve]

First, wrong thread; but I don't really care.
Second, I don't think he was all that his stats showed him to be. Two of his TD's could have easily been TD's for the other team. At the same time he did move the ball down the filed. To answer your question, yes, I think he can. He has a winning record, and if we win more than we drop from now on out, we should be in the playoffs.


Mason's TD was right on the money. It was a hard throw right in front of this. There was only one that wasn't a good throw.

:jester: :jester:

[AZRAVEN]

No, I honestly don't believe we make the playoffs with Boller behind center.. Actually, I have serious doubts that we can make the playoffs with McNair behind center if he doesn't step it up significantly. Boller has not shown me that he can win on the road with any consistancy. I'm also not sure the rest of the team would prform as well with Boller in there given that they have expressed their lack of confidence in him.

[Greg]

Eh, I think Boller's road record is a lot of noise. Yes, he isn't as good on the road, but out of his 7 losses 1 was to C-choke and the rest were to playoff teams like Denver, Philly, etc.

[AZRAVEN]

We have some teams on the road that may well be playoff teams. Ya gotta beat both winners and losers in this league and Boller hasn't really sold me he can consistently.

[StingerNLG]

Unless McNair steps up, we don't make the playoffs reguardless of WHO is behind center.


I'm also not sure the rest of the team would prform as well with Boller in there given that they have expressed their lack of confidence in him.

I think at this point you're talking about a couple of people on defense. Mark Clayton showed without a shadow of a doubt he plays for Boller. The offensive line, well you really can't tell because they have sucked for both Boller and McNair. I think if anything the QB's are going to start expressing a lack of confidence in them soon. Heap and Mason have both said they are still behind Boller. Jamal needs to step his own production up, so he can stay quiet for now.

As for the defense, if they don't play 100% no matter who the QB is, then they should be cut. Period. If Boller being on the field somehow makes Samari Rolle all of a sudden let Steve Smith blow by him time and again, then he needs to go. I think Rolle get's burnt even with McNair on the field anyway.

But the bottom line on offense is until the offensive line actually plays like a real NFL offensive line, we could put any name in there for QB and the answer would continue to be no.

[AZRAVEN]

Unless McNair steps up, we don't make the playoffs reguardless of WHO is behind center.

But the bottom line on offense is until the offensive line actually plays like a real NFL offensive line, we could put any name in there for QB and the answer would continue to be no.

Excellent point, and I don't see anyway that will happen without changes that I don't see Billick making.

[StingerNLG]

Excellent point, and I don't see anyway that will happen without changes that I don't see Billick making.

I was watching MASN a bit ago when they were doing the local SportsCenter update. Derrick Mason said they weren't going to make that many changes, it was the players that had to step up.

We'll see. New Orleans is where it all starts.

[Greg]

If it is true the players weren't happy because Fassel wasn't putting in the preparation and film study they thought was needed, perhaps they will step up for Billick.

[StingerNLG]

I really hope so. I'd like to go to the Cincy game with some confidence that our offense turned the corner and we could hang with the Bengals. Right now I am running a little short on that confidence and would really like to see some sort of spark other than Boller coming in. Now is the time.

[Art-Florida]

Without all the extranneous bullshit, in a word - yes.

[darb72]

Yes, but Bollers 3 TDs don't really factor into it. Two were tipped passes though on the first one Boller did drive the team down field to get in posistion for that play.

Boller moved the ball better than McNair has and McNair is 4-1 in games he's completed. If the defense continues to play the way they did the first 5 weeks of the season I think we could make the play-offs with anybody under center.

Hopefully it won't come to that and McNair will remain our starter.

[Mobtown]

I would love to be proven wrong...but my gut says "No way...not now, not ever"

[StingerNLG]

I would love to be proven wrong...but my gut says "No way...not now, not ever"


Not ever as a Raven. But then again, McNair at this point doesn't look like he's going to do it until he shows us something.

It will be interesting where Boller goes after his contract is up. If he heads to a team with a good offensive line, which would be of course most every other team in the league, he'll do just fine.

[Greg]

I would love to be proven wrong...but my gut says "No way...not now, not ever"
2003. And please, did you see Wright play last year. We went to the playoffs with him and Wright, I have no doubt he is better than Wright so YES, HE CAN, HE HAS!

[AZRAVEN]

I'd like to believe that also; but I'm sitting here watching Eli Manning and listening to the talking heads expound on how he has such good instincts in knowing where and when to throw the ball and the thought comes to me that is Boller's problem as much an issue of lack of good football instincts as anything else. If so, is there any real expectation that he will develop them. I don't know.

[Greg]

Eli Manning had much better tutelage in college. Boller had 3 years of being thrown on the field with little to no development. His last year with Tedford he put it together and 20 minutes later he was staring into the teeth of the Steeler defense. IF we count the last 3 years as his missing college years all of the sudden the last 6 games look like a damn good start to a pro career.

Yeah, that might be a load of crap and wishful thinking but it is also the truth, maybe Boller will never deliver but I think he is coming around and just don't want him gone without another good shot.

[StingerNLG]

But with all due respect to Eli, look at the team he's playing with. Tiki Barber ONCE AGAIN is playing like an MVP, which takes a ton of pressure off the QB. And that offensive line is letting him set back there and throw.

We don't have nearly the ability to protect the QB that the Giants seem to have. Eli's been sacked just once. I wish we had the Giant's OL. We'd be talking about how great our offense is.

That said, Eli is really starting to look pretty good in his own right as well. It doesn't hurt to be a Manning. :)

[Greg]

I will be more succinct.
Impossible, LOL, and the following 20-30 lines prove me right.

[StingerNLG]

AZ, do yourself a favor. In fact, everyone; Greg, FH, etc: ignore the troll. I haven't even bothered to read the post, but just seeing old-tex's name suggests the thread will be headed downhill in a giant hurry.

Don't engage him, and let's try to keep THIS thread from becoming like all the rest.

[darb72]

"It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that Boller or any QB worth his salt MUST be able to beat playoff teams on the road at some point, or else his team will never sniff the playoffs."

McNair is in deep crap then. Because his one away game against a play-off caliber opponent resulted in a below 40 QB rating.

[AZRAVEN]

I understand the lack of an OL, lord knows I've been screaming about it long enough, but aren't "instincts" different than just being taught something? I don't mean to be argumentative but instinct seems to say to me that they just know inside themselves what they should do and Boller just doesn't seem to have a clue. He's been with the Ravens what now four years and he still is making the same mistakes he made his first game. I don't disagree that bringing him in and throwing him right to the wolves was stupid on the Ravens part. I lay that right at Billick's door, he was so obsessed with ridding himself of Chris Redman that he would have started a JV quarterback if he had to. That being said, in spite of four years experience, numerous hand holders, how many so called quarterback developer coaches he still doesn't seem to me to have made much progress. I realize he was a "project", there is that word again, but how much longer can this team afford to give him to develop some consistancy?

[Mista T]

Yes. Boller is playing with confidence. He can stretch the defenses to open it up for Jamal. That isn't happening under Mcnair. I don't see us making the playoffs with McNair unless there's a major turnaround in his passing. He has to stop regressing.

:T2:

[StingerNLG]

AZ, then explain why Steve McNair has been making the EXACT same mistakes Boller has made, and he's been in the league 11 years? I don't mind you being argumentative, but you still have to consider the fact that QB's don't play well here. McNair has in only 5 and a quarter games with the Ravens:

- Thrown 7 interceptions. Two of them right to the opponent.

- Fumbled the ball without being touched

- Tripped over his own feet

- Tripped over Mike Flynn's feet, multiple times.

- Overthrows

- Underthrows

EDIT for RavenDomination:

- Thrown duck passes off his back foot.

This is a guy who is 11 years in, a former MVP, been to the Super Bowl, been to the Pro Bowl, and he puts up a 34.6 (darb was being generous with the 40) QB rating on the road in Denver? Puts up a 64.1 rating overall? The only thing you can't say he's done that Boller has done is miss guys downfield, because McNair doesn't throw downfield. Maybe with Billick he will now, but I'll wait to see it first.

Dude, we've had multiple pro-bowl QB's here. We've had high and low draft picks. We've had college record breakers. None of them have played to the level that we expected them to. Boller just happens to be the one first rounder we've tried.

So if all these QB's have tried and failed, where does the problem really lie? Instict? Instinct means nothing when you're on your back, injured on the sidelines, or running for your life every third play.



Now, let's talk about progress for a second. I don't want to overharp on the stats Greg keeps putting up, but you realize in Boller's last 8 games, which goes back to the overtime win against Pittsburgh:

- Boller has an 82.8 QB rating

- He's thrown 14 touchdowns and 13 interceptions.

- Completion ratio went up to 57.8%

- YPA was at 6.5

- Three games in a row a receiver Boller threw to had a 100 yards. Mark Clayton @ Denver, Todd Heap against Green Bay, and Derrick Mason against Minnesota (who at the time was a playoff contender). That is something that hasn't been done on the Ravens in quite some time. In fact in that game he almost had two.

Now I realize that everyone has their special little spin on stats, and some people who use to use stats to bash Boller now switch to wins and losses to praise McNair (although Boller is also 4-4 in his last 8 starts, and I'm not saying that's you), but you can't call that a lack of progress. Especially considering we've got a guy who should be having a great time with all this talent on the offense sitting at 64.

Now, does that excuse his poor road record? Absolutely not. Although while I do believe Boller himself lost the Denver game, he had help losing in Cleveland; starting with a touchdown nullifying penalty by JO that actually would have been the difference between a win and a loss. Yes, Boller missed a couple of passes he needed, but he had some good passes dropped and a 20 yarder to Mason towards the end also pulled back by an Ovie Mughelli hands to the face penalty that put them in that position to chuck downfield in the first place. That was a team loss, but not many want to admit that.

Does he need to pull together some consistency? Absolutely, and he was doing that towards the end getting the rapport you now see that he has with Mark Clayton.

But does it mean he doesn't have a clue? There's only one other person here who tries to pull that out of his ass, and he doesn't use facts nor does he watch all the games, and we both know that's not you.

I think you're mistaking instinct with trying to work within a system that simply isn't built for Quarterback success. And I would nearly guarantee that Boller would be able to go to a team like KC, or Minnesota, or a place where the offensive line would be able to protect him, and he would look much better than he does here.

[RavensDomination]

It is astonishing to me how badly Boller plays on the road. I don't care how good the competition is, he doesn't step it up

How bad did Boller play at the Meadowlands vs. the Jets?

Oh and Stinger, add "throwing off his back foot" to the list of things McNair has done just like Boller and also throwing 3 yard dump offs on 3rd and long, another thing people used to hold against Boller.

[StingerNLG]

How bad did Boller play at the Meadowlands vs. the Jets?

RD, he may not have actually watched that game.

I'd ignore him. Seriously, it can only go downhill.


Oh and Stinger, add "throwing off his back foot" to the list of things McNair has done just like Boller and also throwing 3 yard dump offs on 3rd and long, another thing people used to hold against Boller.

Ahhh. Although I'll be real honest, I don't attribute throwing off the back foot to McNair; that's an OL issue and not having a pocket to throw in, which as you elude to is something no one excused for Boller.

[highwater]

I will be more succinct.

:rolling:

[StingerNLG]

Highwater, don't get sucked in. Just ignore him. It's like the obnoxious guy in the bar that keeps trying to but into a conversation he's not welcome in. If you ignore him, he'll go away. Unless he's really desperate for attention..

Come on, let's get back to the discussion at hand. Don't even bother with old-tex.

[highwater]

Highwater, don't get sucked in. Just ignore him.


Sorry Stinger, but when someone writes "I will be more succinct" and then proceeds to write the same lengthy thesis he always writes, that's actually pretty funny.

To get back to the original topic, yes, I do believe we could make the playoffs with Boller as the starting QB. He played well against Carolina and reintroduced the deep throw to the offense, which has been lacking with McNair. I don't buy the "he doesn't have the instincts" argument -- I think he can get the job done. What we need, however, is a running game.

[Greg]

Some of you people slay me with the McNair bashing, ...
I am not bashing McNair. You bash Boller and I am compelled to point out the comparison.


Um, how many of those "deep throws" did he actually complete?
That depends on how you categorize those throws, but if we go by balls thrown to a target more than 25 yards downfield I think he threw about 5 and hit one. THAT is pretty damn good when compared against the league. These kind of throws hurt your completion percentage. Now if we go back, how many times this SEASON has McNair thrown at a target 25 or more yards downfield? Has he even tried 5 times this season?

Point, even dinking and dunking the ball hasn't led to a great completion percentage for McNair.

[Greg]

Refreshing.

[StingerNLG]

That depends on how you categorize those throws, but if we go by balls thrown to a target more than 25 yards downfield I think he threw about 5 and hit one. THAT is pretty damn good when compared against the league. These kind of throws hurt your completion percentage. Now if we go back, how many times this SEASON has McNair thrown at a target 25 or more yards downfield? Has he even tried 5 times this season?

Didn't McNair connect on one of his deep throws too? I believe he did. The problem is that he threw it right to a San Diego Charger. :/

There's a reason those throws are called "high percentage". Other QB's maybe complete 1 out of 5 deep throws, and you have to account for the defense getting into position since the ball is in the air for so long. I could go on, but why?


What we need, however, is a running game.

Could not agree more Highwater. It's been missing now for 2 years. When our running backs are getting 17 yards a game, or 40 yards a game, or 60 yards a game, chances are you're not going to win that game without some good fortune from the defense.

[AZRAVEN]

I'm honestly not trying to be argumentative, Stringer. I don't profess to be a football expect, I'm just a fan trying to understand what the hell is going on with the offense of this team. I guess I brought up the "instinct" thing bcause Theisman kept harping on it with Manning last night. Yes, I know Joe harps on everything, but he was bringing up knowing which shoulder to throw to on certain passes, etc. These are things Boller seems to have consistant trouble with, or at least, that's what I have heard commented on and read about here. So I was trying to get opinions from you guys who do know a lot about football as to the validity of his argument.
I have never doubted for one second that much of the problem with our offense is OL related. My history both here and on the Insider board and even back to the one before that has been harping about how badly our OL needs a major overhaul. I have had a new one ripped on many occasions by posters who think the OL is fine and it's all the QB.
Don't think my comments are "picking sides" on the QB debate because frankly I don't really like either of them. I am on record at the time he was drafted as saying I thought Boller was a bad pick and I haven't changed my mind. I was also on record as not being thrilled with bringing McNair in, I think he is an aging, overpaid desperation move to try to jump start the offense and I don't think it will work. My frist choice was to have brought in Brees or looked to the draft for Boller's replacement.
That said, they are the options we have which is why, I guess, I have been labeled a pessimist by some here because I think it will be hard to win consistentlywith either of them. As far as Boller's improved stats.. 14 touchdowns and 13 interceptions really doesn't thrill me at all.

[StingerNLG]

AZ, at some point you have to get my name right you know. There's no r at the beginning. :)

Theismann though has said the same things about Boller on Monday night football. On the Minnesota game, all three of those guys were talking about Boller's good instincts and how different a player he's becoming. Remember, Theismann and co. tend to make everything positive. Theismann's also written about how much he has liked Boller. So I know what you are saying, but he does that with a lot of QB's.

I don't think you don't know football BTW. I just think you sort of concentrate on maybe the stuff that isn't quite what you think it is. Like taking Heap's McNair comments and saying he's slapping Boller. Or things like that. You gotta step back and look at the big picture, that's all.

As for the TD's/INT's, would you take 14/13 over 5/7 right now? I would. I'd also take that 82.7 rating over the last 8 games to the 64 rating our current QB is sitting at now.


I have never doubted for one second that much of the problem with our offense is OL related. My history both here and on the Insider board and even back to the one before that has been harping about how badly our OL needs a major overhaul. I have had a new one ripped on many occasions by posters who think the OL is fine and it's all the QB.

That right there though is the right answer. Those who rip that are simply those that hate a QB so much that they can't see what's happening right on the field, or they're not watching the games. The offensive line has hampered almost every QB that has run through that tunnel in the last now 7 years. It's no coincidence, and you're 100% right about it, and it's the one thing we agree on.

See, you have some football knowledge! :thumbup:

[Mista T]

:ref: :ref: :ref: :ref: :ref: :ref: :ref: :ref: :ref: :ref: :ref:


I don't think you don't know football BTW.

:thumbdown:

And I don't think any members should be tossing pissy comments at others! Let's all get back to commenting on the positions stated, not the person stating them. Thanks.

:mrt:

[StingerNLG]

Ummm, T, that was a compliment. Re-read that. AZ said:


I don't profess to be a football expect, I'm just a fan trying to understand what the hell is going on with the offense of this team.

And I said:


I don't think you don't know football BTW.

That's a double negative, which negates the negative and makes it a positive. As in, I think he's more knowledgable than he thinks he is.

You can pick the yellow flag up now, there was no foul on the play. :)

[Mista T]

OK, mea culpa Stinger. I'm in a different time zone, or whatever! I just really like the way that this QB Forum has turned out, and I just want to see it continue. Now ... for my mid-morning nap!:laugh:

[StingerNLG]

Hehehe, I don't blame you for being trigger happy T. It's been getting dicey in here lately. Luckily there are a couple new guys that are much easier to debate recently.

[AZRAVEN]

Mea Culpa, stinger, I don't think I ever noticed that there wasn't an "r" in your handle. In my mind you have always been stringer.. Living in the land of the scorpion I should have figured that out, I'm sorry.. and embarrased.. :embarassed:
Actually, I really don't know much about the finer points of the game, which is one reason I have always liked reading these boards because of the tremendous insights most of you guys have on the ins and outs of the game. You are probably also right that I concentrate on things that really aren't that important, that's part of not really knowing the game. With the help of the bright people here hopefully I'll be able to up my football IQ. I'm trying to up my game and appreciate your patience, it's nice that when my ignorance shows I'm not slapped clear to Thursday.

[Raven31]

That ignore feature is such a blessing. Thanks for the reminder Stinger. :thumbup:

[highwater]

That's a double negative, which negates the negative and makes it a positive. As in, I think he's more knowledgable than he thinks he is.

You can pick the yellow flag up now, there was no foul on the play. :)

Actually Stinger, there was a foul and it was your double negative -- easily avoidable. I should know, I've been reading and writing sentences for forty years, and I know what I'm talking about. You will never have any success as a writer if you continue with those double negatives!

[StingerNLG]

AZ, seriously, don't be embarrassed,. Honestly it's cool man. I know you weren't doing it on purpose. I was just finally getting around to letting you know. :)

It's all good with me my friend. No worries.

And honestly. The best way to up your football IQ on your team of choice (which is a good thing to be Ravens), is simply continue to watch the games as closely as possible. You pick up a lot of the various rules and how's and why's by watching the game go by. It also doesn't hurt to hit the sites like NFL.com, askthecommish.com, theredzone.org, profootball-reference.com, and the like. You can get massive amounts of stats and info there.



Actually Stinger, there was a foul and it was your double negative -- easily avoidable. I should know, I've been reading and writing sentences for forty years, and I know what I'm talking about. You will never have any success as a writer if you continue with those double negatives!

DOH!!! Ouch! :)

[Gwaihir]

Actually, I think Boller could lead us to the Playoffs! Both of those deep balls against the Panthers could have been caught, the one to Clayton, especially. If he had worked with the first string all week in practice, I think they would have been. The timing was just a tad off. Everyone wants to harp on the two “lucky tipped passes”, but did they watch the rest of the game? Kyle made some damn good throws in that game especially the TD to Heap!

I thought he looked real good in the pre-season except for the first game and he definitely is a threat to go deep on you. This loosens everything else up and all of a sudden there is room to run and throw the underneath stuff. I still like McNair as the starter for now, but definitely wouldn’t cash in the season if he were to get hurt! I think the light bulb is definitely starting to turn on for Kyle and would definitely bum out if the Ravens let him go now. What is he, all of 25 or something like that? If the Ravens keep him around, I think he’s going to make a lot of people on this board eat some major crow!

[StingerNLG]

but did they watch the rest of the game?

At least for one person here the answer is no Gwaihir. :/

[Gwaihir]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I keep seeing misguided posts where Boller is a threat to go deep yet if you just look at his career stats he is one of the worst QB's in the league at connecting on passes over 25 yards.

It’s a popular misconception to think that you have to complete a deep ball to have a deep threat, but this is far from the truth! I guess what you are saying is that when our receivers get 25 yards down field they are left uncovered since we haven’t completed one that far yet! I don’t think so, If you heave the ball down field at least once per possession the defense has to respect that and cover it whether you complete any or not! And, like I said, this will loosen them up to the point where they can’t crowd 8 guys around the line of scrimmage. All of a sudden, you can run the ball and there’s more room to complete the underneath routes!

[Mista T]

If you heave the ball down field at least once per possession the defense has to respect that and cover it whether you complete any or not!

Bingo! It's very elementary. Connecting on a few helps, e.g. the Green Bay, Minnesota, and Houston games.

In my opinion, McNair's inability or unwillingness to loosen up the defenses by heaving the ball 25 yards past the line of scrimmage in the air is directly attributable to impeding the running game and even impacts his short stuff. If McNair starts next Sunday, watch how the Saints econdary crowds up.

:T2:

[StingerNLG]

The other thing Gwaihir is that you have to determine how many times the ball is being thrown downfield. That is something that you can't find on a stat sheet. You also can't find on a mainstream stat sheet a completion percentage of deep throws. It's been no secret the Ravens don't have the offensive line to allow receivers enough time to get downfield, so we don't throw a lot of deep balls to begin with. That's why you have a YPA, which for Boller went up to 6.14 in 2005 and in his Panthers game was 7.29.


BTW they also don't measure passes on nfl.com 25+ yards. They use 20+.

And not that I want to keep using stats, because those seem to be avoided like the plague these days, but in 6 games:

Steve McNair has 0 completions 40+ yards. Boller has 1 in 1 game.

Steve McNair has 8 completions 20+ in 6 games, which means roughly 1 intermediate pass per game on average???

Here's another interesting stat. In 8 games in 2005, Boller completed 20 passes 20+ yards. In 14 games in 2005, McNair only completed 29 passes 20+ yards.

Doesn't sound like a giant leap to me.

[AZRAVEN]

It is the possibility that one of the long passes will click - whether by design or accident (like the two tips against the Panthers) that necessitates a defense to defend against it. Nothing demoralizes a defense faster than getting burned by a long ball because then there is no hope of recovery. The dink and dunks or run plays they can kind of figure we'll get em next time but once that long ball hits it's done. If Boller could ever manage to hit a few of them I really think it would pull a guy or two out of the box and then maybe, if he was in the mood, Jamal could break some runs. I don't think for one minute that McNair can do that anymore.:(

[RavenDavey]

In my opinion, McNair's inability or unwillingness to loosen up the defenses by heaving the ball 25 yards past the line of scrimmage in the air is directly attributable to impeding the running game and even impacts his short stuff. If McNair starts next Sunday, watch how the Saints secondary crowds up.:T2:

Speaking of short stuff...if McNair could complete the short pass or screen pass, we might be able to put up some big RAC yards! Ya think that might spark the passing game, and better yet the offense?

[Greg]

Boller hit Williams on a long one last game. And it was THROWN long, any passes McNair has that are 20+ yards more than likely got there via YAC and not his arm.


You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I keep seeing misguided posts where Boller is a threat to go deep yet if you just look at his career stats he is one of the worst QB's in the league at connecting on passes over 25 yards.
I am constantly putting up stats for you, so let's see these stats. Come on, link to them. We're waiting. I want Boller's rate, the league average and McNair's.

[PARavensJeff]

Greg is right, McNair is dinking & dunking, Boller stretches the field. Anyone at the game vs. Carolina or watching on TV can see that. Boller will never get a fair shake here. My prediction is he walks after his contract expires next year, goes somewhere else, & becomes a good starting QB. He is learning from McNair right now, & it's all coming together for him now. He finally has what he should have had in 04, someone to talk to him & teach him. Someone to explain to him & take the time to do that. I'm sure one of these bright bulb Anti-Bollers will bash me, but that's my story & I'm sticking to it. When this happens, they'll all have revisionist memories & wonder why we didn't keep the guy, how could we let him go.

[StingerNLG]

Anyone at the game vs. Carolina or watching on TV can see that.

Well Jeff, there is your first problem. Not everyone here watched that game.



I am constantly putting up stats for you, so let's see these stats. Come on, link to them. We're waiting. I want Boller's rate, the league average and McNair's.

Greg, I put those stats right up above and predicably they got ignored, so I will repeat them.

And keep in mind they do not measure passes by 25 yards or better, they measure them by 20 yards or better, and can easily be looked up at NFL.com:

In 2006 Steve McNair has 0 completions 40+ yards. Boller has 1 in 1 game.

In 2006 Steve McNair has 8 completions 20+ in 6 games, which means roughly 1 intermediate pass per game on average. Boller has 2 in 1 game.


Now, let's go to 2005 shall we?

In 8 games in 2005, Boller completed 20 passes of 20+ yards. Average of 2.5 per game.

In 14 games in 2005, McNair only completed 29 passes 20+ yards. Average of 2.1 per game.

The only place McNair shows better long numbers is in 40+ passes where in 14 games McNair has 7 and in 8 games Boller has 1. And again, McNair played almost twice as long.

Doesn't sound like a giant leap to me. I'm looking, but I don't see where McNair was so superior in throwing deep balls. In fact, it looks like Boller was slightly better or right on par with McNair throwing intermediate to deep as well.