respect for Flacco

[ram29jackson]

with all the media and the internet the one thing I didnt know was that Flacco was 24. Not 21- 22 like most rookies. that is at least some explaination why he did decently his 1st year. He was a little more mature. Not bad for a guy from a 1 aa scholl.

yet, he was still a rookie and at some point that had to matter against being successfull. I dont hate rookies or the Ravens. I just know that numbers dont lie and things have to develop for things to improve and take a certain place.

and like I said , parity plays a part in lesser talent doing well. The amount of Ravens wins this year with mostly just defense says to me the rest of the league wasnt that strong. and Flacco isnt use to playing this many games, doesnt know the playbook etc. The Steelers had more weapons on offense, already beat the Ravens twice and were at home. I have favorite teams I root for but again, more often than not, numbers dont lie. and by numbers I mean what you research on -rivals.com - etc. not what media tells you. The Ravens got 15 more points than I said they would but I was only 4 off of the Steelers.

I cant predict the future. I am just saying I knew the Steelers had an offense and the Ravens didnt. This is nothing for you to take personal. its just football fan chatter.

Lets see how he -Flacco- develops as your defense will have to go through a transition the next year or 2.

see you guys next summer...- you need Ravens smileys :happy:

[Aces2Bluff]

Didnt the ravens had a better offense then the steelers in the regular season...
Oh wait thats right numbers dont lie...
Baltimores Total Offense-18
Steelers-22nd

Flacco's QB Rating was better then Bens

Seriously dude research your numbers before you post

[ram29jackson]

Didnt the ravens had a better offense then the steelers in the regular season...
Oh wait thats right numbers dont lie...
Baltimores Total Offense-18
Steelers-22nd

Flacco's QB Rating was better then Bens

Seriously dude research your numbers before you post

LOL you just dont get it do you. the whole deal- the records and ratings of the teams they played- the match ups etc.
Flacco didnt throw as much as Roth. being 4 spots away in the nfl is the matter of a few yrds. you have to be more savvy than just basic looks at numbers.

[Aces2Bluff]

Says the guy who says in the original post
"I just know that numbers dont lie and things have to develop for things to improve and take a certain place."

If you really want I can break down individually stats and scenarios and give a case for Baltimore having a better offense.

then follow it up with Ben had more throwing attempts.... yea by 41... really if your gonna say 4 spots arent a huge deal, im going to say that 41 attempts arent either.

Seriously dude...

I give respect to the Steelers for their win and say they earned it last night, but there is no way in hell I will say that there offense is better.


EDIT* You know what Im bored and im drunk so I might as well throw some numbers out:

Ben Rothlesberger QB Rating against teams with winning records outside of the division:
QB Rating: 80.9,59,75.2,38.5,50.6,96.4,86.4
Average Rating=69.57

Joe Flacco QB Rating against teams with winning records outside of the divison
Joe Flacco-96.9,120.2,58.1,95.5,50.4
Average Rating=84.22


Willie Parker
3.75 ypc 5 Td's, 0 td's when behind in a game
Le'Ron McClain
3.9 ypc 10 td's 4 td's when behind in a game

Ill add more when I feel your worth the effort

[ram29jackson]

Says the guy who says in the original post

If you really want I can break down individually stats and scenarios and give a case for Baltimore having a better offense.

then follow it up with Ben had more throwing attempts.... yea by 41... really if your gonna say 4 spots arent a huge deal, im going to say that 41 attempts arent either.

Seriously dude...

I give respect to the Steelers for their win and say they earned it last night, but there is no way in hell I will say that there offense is better.

41 says alot by the things that happened on those throws. the Pitt off- was obviously more productive , when it needed to be. no ones attacking you personally , take it easy. I compliment Flacco and you still need to type a negative hissy fit...? take it easy, man.

[camdenyard]

Ben is a better improvisational QB than Flacco at this point. Some of those schoolyard throws he made were great, some catches were pure luck. But, luck is part of the game.

Flacco can only get better with time and seasoning. He got a lot of great experience this year, and being in 3 playoff games and winning 2 will pay dividends...hopefully next year.

Yes, by the numbers the Ravens had a better offense this year. But Ben is the better QB at this stage. I dare say that had the Ravens not had to play an extra playoff game, had McClain been able to go 100% and had we been at home, the result may have been reversed. Who knows.

These two teams are very evenly matched and I expect that to be the case for a while.

[RavensInBrazil]

Erm, Pitt's offense scored 2 more points than Baltimore's. Excuse me while I ignore this "they have an offense" BS

[JimZipCode]

the one thing I didnt know was that Flacco was 24. Not 21- 22 like most rookies
Joe turned 24 this past Friday, before the Steelers game. He was 23 during the reg season.

[Aces2Bluff]

I dont take it personal....

I just dont see how they had a better offense....

[camdenyard]

You opened it up with "numbers don't lie" yada yada. So when presented with numbers you backpeddal. Here are more numbers: 24.1 (Ravens) vs 21.7 ppg.

[ram29jackson]

Joe turned 24 this past Friday, before the Steelers game. He was 23 during the reg season.

in sports that makes a big differance

[POPSinPA]

Numbers don't lie unless of course they are being thrown back at you, huh?

Go away troll...

[ram29jackson]

You opened it up with "numbers don't lie" yada yada. So when presented with numbers you backpeddal. Here are more numbers: 24.1 (Ravens) vs 21.7 ppg.



I didnt back pedal in any way shape or form. like I said, numbers have to do with quality of match ups etc. the Ravens averageing 3 more than A team they lost to twice doesnt tell me i'm wrong in saying the Steelers were superior to them.

[4G63]

You opened it up with "numbers don't lie" yada yada. So when presented with numbers you backpeddal. Here are more numbers: 24.1 (Ravens) vs 21.7 ppg.

The difference is Big Ben.....he is the better QB right now....

[Rex Thunder]

41 says alot by the things that happened on those throws. the Pitt off- was obviously more productive , when it needed to be. no ones attacking you personally , take it easy. I compliment Flacco and you still need to type a negative hissy fit...? take it easy, man.

He attacks you because you are acting arrogant to the point of asserting that you know what you are talking about- when you really don't.

Unless you have watched every Ravens game since their inception to Baltimore could you have any clue about the offense.

You're right, numbers DON'T tell the whole story. Up until this yeah, the defense NEVER had faith in the offense. They always felt like they had to win the games themselves- and therefore took chances that sometimes bit them in the ass.

This year against Cleveland, down by 14 points on the road to a division rival- Flacco lead the offense to 24 unanswered points (7 of which came by way of defensive td AFTER Flacco had taken over the leaf.) His numbers were okay that game- but what was more important was the realization that when pressed- this offense CAN deliver. And since that point- the faith and trust between the offense and defense built to the point that for the first time the locker room really felt together and like a team. Flacco didn't always have to WIN the game like he did that day- but by the defense now BELIEVING in the offense- it just picked up the entire squad.

YOu can't quantify accountability on a team... and once the offense proved itself- in a way that no other Baltimore offense had been able to do in the past 10 years- EVERYONE became accountable- on BOTH sides of the ball. That meant- no more gambling on defense (at least ALL the time), no more letting your teammates down with selfish sportsmanship penalties. NO more bad decisions trying to make a play on offense. It's hard to describe what happened with this team. Defensive guys hold their position. Flacco throws the ball away rather than risking an INT. Sounds simple- but without the pure faith in one another- those things didn't always happen- moreso on defense, but it did happen more times than youd think on offense.

YOU- looking at pure numbers- and your opinion- for as much as you will deny it- based so much on past success and perception of the Baltimore offense- has no bearing in reality because you JUST DON'T KNOW.

The Baltimore offense will never get the credit they deserve with our defense so star studded with playmakers and big personalities- but make no doubt- it was the offense's success that opened the door to the type of season we had. The offensive and defensive players came together in a way that I've never seen and it leaves lots of room for optimism.

The numbers do lie- when you don't know the whole story....

and ps- You blatantly throw "schedules, opponents...etc" as reasons people might not realize affecting "the numbers." Such an ignorant statement... yeah- that's true- but not when the strength of schedule is almost exactly the same. Stop pretending to know what you are talking about and come back in 10 years when you've watched a little more football.

[Rex Thunder]

I didnt back pedal in any way shape or form. like I said, numbers have to do with quality of match ups etc. the Ravens averageing 3 more than A team they lost to twice doesnt tell me i'm wrong in saying the Steelers were superior to them.

There you go contradicting yourself. So you're saying because one team won- that's mean they are a better team?

Did you watch those games? Yeah, the ravens lost both games- but they pretty much dominated the better half of both of them. Yeah they blew the leads in both... but in those cases being a rookie did come in to play- but it doesn't discount the success of the offense as a whole. Did you even watch the prior games against Pittsburgh- or did you, let me guess. get the stats of the games from rivals.com.

The thread is meandering off topic- as far as the Steelers- their experience made them the slightly better team this year... but in just about every category and way- the teams are about as closely matched as any two teams can be. BUt whatever, I don't even know what we're arguing about anymore.... the season is over so we don't need some instigating Rams fan trying to "school" us on football right now.

[ram29jackson]

He attacks you because you are acting arrogant to the point of asserting that you know what you are talking about- when you really don't.

Unless you have watched every Ravens game since their inception to Baltimore could you have any clue about the offense.

You're right, numbers DON'T tell the whole story. Up until this yeah, the defense NEVER had faith in the offense. They always felt like they had to win the games themselves- and therefore took chances that sometimes bit them in the ass.

This year against Cleveland, down by 14 points on the road to a division rival- Flacco lead the offense to 24 unanswered points (7 of which came by way of defensive td AFTER Flacco had taken over the leaf.) His numbers were okay that game- but what was more important was the realization that when pressed- this offense CAN deliver. And since that point- the faith and trust between the offense and defense built to the point that for the first time the locker room really felt together and like a team. Flacco didn't always have to WIN the game like he did that day- but by the defense now BELIEVING in the offense- it just picked up the entire squad.

YOu can't quantify accountability on a team... and once the offense proved itself- in a way that no other Baltimore offense had been able to do in the past 10 years- EVERYONE became accountable- on BOTH sides of the ball. That meant- no more gambling on defense (at least ALL the time), no more letting your teammates down with selfish sportsmanship penalties. NO more bad decisions trying to make a play on offense. It's hard to describe what happened with this team. Defensive guys hold their position. Flacco throws the ball away rather than risking an INT. Sounds simple- but without the pure faith in one another- those things didn't always happen- moreso on defense, but it did happen more times than youd think on offense.

YOU- looking at pure numbers- and your opinion- for as much as you will deny it- based so much on past success and perception of the Baltimore offense- has no bearing in reality because you JUST DON'T KNOW.

The Baltimore offense will never get the credit they deserve with our defense so star studded with playmakers and big personalities- but make no doubt- it was the offense's success that opened the door to the type of season we had. The offensive and defensive players came together in a way that I've never seen and it leaves lots of room for optimism.

The numbers do lie- when you don't know the whole story....

and ps- You blatantly throw "schedules, opponents...etc" as reasons people might not realize affecting "the numbers." Such an ignorant statement... yeah- that's true- but not when the strength of schedule is almost exactly the same. Stop pretending to know what you are talking about and come back in 10 years when you've watched a little more football.


LOL i already said I cant predict the future. But I have seen things enough to know when and where a team may come out on top. its not just numbers. its my ability to interpret them. No ,the schedules werent the same and neither were the match ups. yes, you cant know till the game is played. But I have been around long enough to know what I see and how it works most of the time. of course you cant account for human factors. but odds makers are seldom wrong and there are reasons for that. no one is being arrogant . I'm just discussing football stats and possibilties. but you guys must be younger so you are taking it too personal. lighten up, its just fan banter.

[Big Bird]

Flacco is the heart of the Ravens offense at this point. With improvement in the O-Line and receivers, he will land among those who we call great!!!

I take my hat off to the accomplishments of this years team. God, who coulda predicted it?

:happyanim

[ram29jackson]

Flacco is the heart of the Ravens offense at this point. With improvement in the O-Line and receivers, he will land among those who we call great!!!

I take my hat off to the accomplishments of this years team. God, who coulda predicted it?

:happyanim

thats more like it

[myfavoriteboxer]

Rex is right. It looks less important on paper after such a good season, and wins over better opponents like Miami, Dallas, Wash., or Philly, but that Cleveland win was truly special. (Also Cleveland by the end of the season was down to its last-string QB and was playing worse football than Detroit, but for our game with them Anderson was making some great plays, until that last pick six.) I had become too accustomed to thinking that a 14-pt deficit in the 2nd half spelled absolute doom, and the way we came back was one of two big "wow" moments I remember having with Flacco this season.

I still follow the team when we're not doing well, but I'm out of state and don't get the games unless they're on national TV or I take myself to a bar that has Sunday Ticket. Lets just say I make less of an effort to get out and watch say, a 2005 team that lost to Detroit. So I was half tuned out for this draft, and hadn't done much research on who was available. Reading up on the Flacco pick, I thought, great, we choose another 1st round QB for his arm strength and little else. Why did he transfer to UD? Didn't feel like competing to be a starter? Well, guess it got him his payday, good for him, possibly Boller II for us. But I watched more games this season than I have since 2004, partly out of curiosity.

Anyway, when Flacco had made a bad play in Wk 4, basically to lose the game at the Steelers, to see him shrug it off the way he did and drive us all the way down the field for a TD to tie the game in the 4th quarter on national TV made me, and probably a lot of us think, ok, this guy might be for real.

[ram29jackson]

Rex is right. It looks less important on paper after such a good season, and wins over better opponents like Miami, Dallas, Wash., or Philly, but that Cleveland win was truly special. (Also Cleveland by the end of the season was down to its last-string QB and was playing worse football than Detroit, but for our game with them Anderson was making some great plays, until that last pick six.) I had become too accustomed to thinking that a 14-pt deficit in the 2nd half spelled absolute doom, and the way we came back was one of two big "wow" moments I remember having with Flacco this season.

I still follow the team when we're not doing well, but I'm out of state and don't get the games unless they're on national TV or I take myself to a bar that has Sunday Ticket. Lets just say I make less of an effort to get out and watch say, a 2005 team that lost to Detroit. So I was half tuned out for this draft, and hadn't done much research on who was available. Reading up on the Flacco pick, I thought, great, we choose another 1st round QB for his arm strength and little else. Why did he transfer to UD? Didn't feel like competing to be a starter? Well, guess it got him his payday, good for him, possibly Boller II for us. But I watched more games this season than I have since 2004, partly out of curiosity.

Anyway, when Flacco had made a bad play in Wk 4, basically to lose the game at the Steelers, to see him shrug it off the way he did and drive us all the way down the field for a TD to tie the game in the 4th quarter on national TV made me, and probably a lot of us think, ok, this guy might be for real.


yep, it appears he has more than basic talent. But you mentioned dallas and washington. thats what I mean about really looking at odds and stats. those 2 werent really worth a damn in considering them wins against good teams. they werent good teams this year . So beating them with a rookie lead offense isnt saying to me the team was that good in the long run. just an observation Ravens fans, not a personal attack.

[Steelmember]

with all the media and the internet the one thing I didnt know was that Flacco was 24. Not 21- 22 like most rookies. that is at least some explaination why he did decently his 1st year. He was a little more mature. Not bad for a guy from a 1 aa scholl.

yet, he was still a rookie and at some point that had to matter against being successfull. I dont hate rookies or the Ravens. I just know that numbers dont lie and things have to develop for things to improve and take a certain place.

and like I said , parity plays a part in lesser talent doing well. The amount of Ravens wins this year with mostly just defense says to me the rest of the league wasnt that strong. and Flacco isnt use to playing this many games, doesnt know the playbook etc. The Steelers had more weapons on offense, already beat the Ravens twice and were at home. I have favorite teams I root for but again, more often than not, numbers dont lie. and by numbers I mean what you research on -rivals.com - etc. not what media tells you. The Ravens got 15 more points than I said they would but I was only 4 off of the Steelers.

I cant predict the future. I am just saying I knew the Steelers had an offense and the Ravens didnt. This is nothing for you to take personal. its just football fan chatter.

Lets see how he -Flacco- develops as your defense will have to go through a transition the next year or 2.

see you guys next summer...- you need Ravens smileys :happy:

Don't be a moron, the Ravens had a fine offense in the season, especially pounding the rock. And they DID rank higher than the steelers in many categories.

The difference was play in the clutch and that will come for Flacco. Look at Ben's AFCCG as a rookie, he threw 4 picks.

[ram29jackson]

Don't be a moron, the Ravens had a fine offense in the season, especially pounding the rock. And they DID rank higher than the steelers in many categories.

The difference was play in the clutch and that will come for Flacco. Look at Ben's AFCCG as a rookie, he threw 4 picks.

they had fine offense in the parity era isnt saying much. it doesnt matter that they ranked higher. it wasnt by much at all. the ultimate point I am making is they ranked poorly head to head with Pittsburgh and thats all that mattered to me in the playoffs. I am not saying they suck at all . I am saying they were not the smart pick against Pittsburgh. No matter how the game went in eb n flow and highs and lows , they would not win that game. once again - just sports banter. dont get upset.

[srobert96]

[QUOTE=ram29jackson;126924]with all the media and the internet the one thing I didnt know was that Flacco was 24. Not 21- 22 like most rookies. that is at least some explaination why he did decently his 1st year. He was a little more mature. Not bad for a guy from a 1 aa scholl.

He was 23 for the season. He is about the same age as most rookies that stay for 4 or 5 years in College. Maturity is more about experience than age. It was not a maturity or experience thing but more about his personality. That is just who he is. He also usually beats coaches into the complex to start breaking down film on Mondays.

Hopefully the team gets him a few more weapons and allows Cam to open up the offense a little more. The Oline should be a year older and much better next year. Clayton should progress and hopefully McGahee takes the off season seriously. Have D williams back even if they dont get a true #1 will help.

[bmorebirds_24]

Ram29jackson is here to stir up shit. IGNORE HIM!!!!!!!!


He is getting a rise out of people getting pissed off at him. Notice all he ever talks about is "parity" and throws out numbers that end up making him look like a moron. Let him go, let him have this thread to himself, he is like a young child who just found his dong. After time he will leave it alone.

[pyite32]

Ram29jackson is here to stir up shit. IGNORE HIM!!!!!!!!


He is getting a rise out of people getting pissed off at him. Notice all he ever talks about is "parity" and throws out numbers that end up making him look like a moron. Let him go, let him have this thread to himself, he is like a young child who just found his dong. After time he will leave it alone.

:iagree:

Don't let this guy stir you up with his back handed "compliments". Just stop responding.

[Steelmember]

Ram29jackson is here to stir up shit. IGNORE HIM!!!!!!!!


He is getting a rise out of people getting pissed off at him. Notice all he ever talks about is "parity" and throws out numbers that end up making him look like a moron. Let him go, let him have this thread to himself, he is like a young child who just found his dong. After time he will leave it alone.

Great analogy.
:word

[ram29jackson]

Ram29jackson is here to stir up shit. IGNORE HIM!!!!!!!!


He is getting a rise out of people getting pissed off at him. Notice all he ever talks about is "parity" and throws out numbers that end up making him look like a moron. Let him go, let him have this thread to himself, he is like a young child who just found his dong. After time he will leave it alone.


nope, if anything I would like to see guys who dont get a rise out of it and dont have hissy fits. but they seem to take a loss that has nothing to do with them, way too personal. you guys better be under 25 or this looks pretty sad LOL.

I'll be blunt, I knew the Ravens would lose- at least I was 95 % sure LOL and I know how to review stats impartially. and if my favorite team is a definite underdog I dont fool myself into thinking they might win.

at least we all love football !

[bmorebirds_24]

nope, if anything I would like to see guys who dont get a rise out of it and dont have hissy fits. but they seem to take a loss that has nothing to do with them, way too personal. you guys better be under 25 or this looks pretty sad LOL.

I'll be blunt, I knew the Ravens would lose- at least I was 95 % sure LOL and I know how to review stats impartially. and if my favorite team is a definite underdog I dont fool myself into thinking they might win.

at least we all love football !


Age has nothing to do with anything. You bring up stats and I see 3 or 4 people prove you wrong. You talked about how Pittsburgh has a better offense then the Ravens but you must look att he wrong numbers.


I am sure you did know we were going to lose. I bet you were one of the ones at the beginning saying we would go 11-5 right? Or were you realistic and say we would only win 6 games, tops?


Come on, you know here to stir up some very loyal fans. Now if you want to talk football and talk serious, welcome aboard. If you want to throw out crazy numbers and talk a stupid opinion because you just don't like the Ravens, then take a hike.

[ram29jackson]

Age has nothing to do with anything. You bring up stats and I see 3 or 4 people prove you wrong. You talked about how Pittsburgh has a better offense then the Ravens but you must look att he wrong numbers.


I am sure you did know we were going to lose. I bet you were one of the ones at the beginning saying we would go 11-5 right? Or were you realistic and say we would only win 6 games, tops?


Come on, you know here to stir up some very loyal fans. Now if you want to talk football and talk serious, welcome aboard. If you want to throw out crazy numbers and talk a stupid opinion because you just don't like the Ravens, then take a hike.


nope, these so called Ravens fans stirred themselves up. purely because I used this team as an example of parity making things weaker league wide. the fact is you shouldnt be this successful with a rookie QB even if he is slightly above the curve. the league is a joke with 3 QBs having great seasons their 1st year at the same time- LOL I know it was redundant. age has plenty to do with it. you guys are very immature with your posts and take something you have nothing to with on a 1st hand level way too seriously. the Ravens got beat deep repeatedly by a team with a not so great offensive line and the vaunted defense couldnt pound a scrambling QB. next year , your offense will be slightly better but your -D- will start to decline.

[Rayvens52]

nope, these so called Ravens fans stirred themselves up. purely because I used this team as an example of parity making things weaker league wide. the fact is you shouldnt be this successful with a rookie QB even if he is slightly above the curve. the league is a joke with 3 QBs having great seasons their 1st year at the same time- LOL I know it was redundant. age has plenty to do with it. you guys are very immature with your posts and take something you have nothing to with on a 1st hand level way too seriously. the Ravens got beat deep repeatedly by a team with a not so great offensive line and the vaunted defense couldnt pound a scrambling QB. next year , your offense will be slightly better but your -D- will start to decline.

I have kept my mouth shut so far but you have to be the dumbest "sports fan" ever. Let me start of by saying I don't take this personally! To say that he only has success due to the fact of parity in the league is the dumbest argument I have ever heard. If you were anywhere near close to correct on that then every QB taken on day 1 would be a success in the NFL, every Heisman winner would be a MVP. So was Kurt a fluke when he lead you guys to a Super Bowl since he was bagging groceries the year before? The Ravens got beat deep in the AFC CG due to the fact that we were playing with our 4th and 5th string CB's. Why will our D start to decline next year, because you think so...we have heard our D is not going to be as good next year for 10 years and we rank in the top 10 every year. The bottom line was Flacco was successful because he is a good QB, he had a great OC in Cam, and he had players make plays which is what happens with good football teams, the Rams could do the same if everything I just mentioned above happens for your team. The fact that there is parity in the league makes the league stronger not weaker...teams have to learn how to build their teams and most teams with a decent GM can have a good team for 4 to 7 years with proper management, teams become weaker in the league now with poor management and bad coaches period! So if you want post here with shit that makes sense and is not a joke feel free but stop continuing to post your bullshit here!

[RAVENOUS52]

I'm ashamed that any Ravens fans are here giving an obvious troll the time of day.

Shame on you all!! http://smileys.on-my-web.com/repository/Computer/computer-14.gif

[sdeclue]

Flacco had a great year despite his strugges in the AFC championship game. The guy is going to be a good one. I love his confidence and calm demeanor. He just seems like a good kid and a great player to represent the team and city.

[srobert96]

The difference is Big Ben.....he is the better QB right now....

The difference is much more than Ben. The biggest difference is Ward, Holmes, Washington and Miller.

have 1 serviceable receiver in Mason. He is a 35 yr old possession receiver. Clayton is a younger version of Mason.

Big Ben and receivers were also going against Frank Walker and Fabian Washington.

[festivus]

NEWSFLASH

Ram29jackson is a troll.

It is possible he is also an idiot, but at least he is a troll, which means disagreeing with him is pointless. You both get muddy, and the pig likes it.

[section553]

nope, these so called Ravens fans stirred themselves up. purely because I used this team as an example of parity making things weaker league wide. the fact is you shouldnt be this successful with a rookie QB even if he is slightly above the curve. the league is a joke with 3 QBs having great seasons their 1st year at the same time- LOL I know it was redundant. age has plenty to do with it. you guys are very immature with your posts and take something you have nothing to with on a 1st hand level way too seriously. the Ravens got beat deep repeatedly by a team with a not so great offensive line and the vaunted defense couldnt pound a scrambling QB. next year , your offense will be slightly better but your -D- will start to decline.

Who are you to question us Raven fans. This post is your dumbest by far, it makes you sound stupid. Arent there any message boards for lowly Rams fans to discuss how bad your team is.