Restructuring...Jamal??

[bassgtrst]

Ravens | Team trying to restructure J. Lewis' contract
Wed, 21 Feb 2007 21:09:58 -0800

Adam Schefter, of the NFL Network, reports the Baltimore Ravens are trying to restructure RB Jamal Lewis' contract. The team will owe him a $5 million roster bonus due March 3.

Is this to soften the blow of his release or are we seriously trying to keep him?

Will this help our cap situation, or was this preemptively put into the current cap figures?

Could it be to make room for an AD extension??

????

[GreenWave52]

I would rather just be done with Jamal. I will always have fond memories of his time with us, but both parties need to go their seperate ways.

Jamal is not effective here anymore, but if he is still on the roster Billick will give him 20+ carries. It is time to find some explosive fresh blood and to find out what Daniels can do.

PS- I want Musa gone as well. He is always injured and wasting a roster spot.

[Bez513]

I would rather just be done with Jamal. I will always have fond memories of his time with us, but both parties need to go their seperate ways.

Jamal is not effective here anymore, but if he is still on the roster Billick will give him 20+ carries. It is time to find some explosive fresh blood and to find out what Daniels can do.

PS- I want Musa gone as well. He is always injured and wasting a roster spot.

Agreed. Jamal's best days are behind him. We need to look at RB in the draft and get some fresh blood in here.

[Sports Steve]

As good as Jamal has been for us we were good to him also. It's time to move onto another running back next year. Jamal has two bad knees and he can't run as much as he could in the past. His body is very old for his age.

:jester: :jester:

[Khaine]

I was at the 295 yard game a couple years back (man that was a blast!) so I loves ‘em back in the day. But I have to fully agree with ya’ll. He isn’t as quick to find the hole, and even when he finds it, finally smashes through it he no longer has the speed to take advantage of the open field.
Part of me thinks some serious re-structuring of his contract is definitely due but I think that is the heart talking not the mind. The mind says let him go and get some fresh blood back there.

We also need to do something with Anderson, we are paying good money for him and if I recall correctly he only had somewhere around 38 touches last season. Seemed like a waste of cap space… I think if we either drafted someone quick and wiley for the outside runs and utilized Anderson for the pounding runs up the middle we would open a while lot more in the running game.

OK, I’m still new here, I’m going to stop typing now… ;)

[Ravenatic20]

I think if the Ravens are trying to restructure his contract, its so he can stay. Personally, I like Jamal. If he has the determination, he can be good for 1300+ yards next year, assuming he stays healthy.

[PurpleRulz]

Unless we can restructure the deal to save more than 8M, I think we should just cut Jamal. We can use that money to re-sign Pashos and JJ.

[ravenwoman]

I think this is a loyalty thing more than anything else. I would like to see the Ravens go in a new direction with a running back that can cut back run side to side and show some break away speed. Jamal could be like a Jerome Bettis type, but he clearly is not our long term answer and we need someone Steve McNair can depend on, otherwise, we will be too dependent on our passing game.

[ClericBlackDave]

Not suprising, really. Jamal started to run better 2nd half of last year, and he had medical problems.


The issue here is how much we pay him. Replacing him at RB might be tough with a late 1st rounder at best. I wouldn't be suprised to see a restructuring and then see us draft a RB NEXT draft.

[ExiledRaven]

I agree that "restructuring" doesn't really make sense, but what I do agree with is speaking to acquiring a RB next year.

Tony Lombardi, Aaron Wilson and others have consistently spoken favorably of PJ Daniels who seems lost in the shuffle. Musa Smith can't stay healthy, he's out.

So we're going to trust our fate to Mike Anderson, PJ, and some rookie?
Mike Anderson showed spark at times last year, but why didn't he play more when Jamal Lewis was so obviously struggling? Without access to the clubhouse (even then you might not get an answer) all you can do is speculate.

Drafting an early RB makes sense next year when the class appears to be loaded with talent at the position. McFadden, Ray Rice, Steve Slaton, Pat White, Ian Johnson, Jamaal Charles, Jorvorskie Lane, Jonathan Stewart....that's an impressive crop. Slight problem: These RBs know that too and some are bound to take out the $5 million insurance policy and roll the dice on going earlier the next year.

Jamal could come back and be serviceable, but not for an $11.67 million cap figure. Heck, even a $5 million cap figure. Especially not at the cost of losing Jarrett Johnson (at the very least an experienced competent backup), Pashos (average tackle that works super hard, at worst he's depth if not attracting mega attention as a free agent), or Ovie Mughelli assuming he wasn't a contract year wonder.

This also gives the Ravens a year to evaluate PJ Daniels as well. If Daniels looks great, Anderson and Lewis might be gone after the year if a top flight back becomes available to the Ravens.

[ravenmad71]

I think its worth bringing him back but at a REDUCED rate of course. From what I've heard.. I think there talking about a one year deal with a possible option around 3-4 mil. I agree with most everybody else that Jamal's better days seem to have passed. I do however think he is still "servicable" and will help in another championship quest. As far as the draft , it still shoudn't deter the Ravens front office to use either a 1st or 2nd round pick on a RB. The name of Michael Bush and M. Pittman comes to mind just as a thought. Where the other backs fit in .. is still to be determined. Musa Smith has always seemed to be on the brink.. and then he gets injured. Anderson is decent but nothing specatcular.. Daniels.. haven't seen him as of yet so who knows. We''ll find out soon enough free agency and the draft are right around the corner.

[ravcol]

Why are the Ravens being "loyal" to a player that publicly quit on them last year, and who also had the greatest three-year falloff of any RB in NFL history? Oh, that's right, the same reason they are loyal to Ray Lewis who backstabbed his team and head coach, and CMAC, who is simply an idiot. And they cut loose AD? Nice cap planning there. Next thing is we will be keeping a done Flynn and Mulatalo to keep Ogden happy. Sheesh.

[festivus]

Why are the Ravens being "loyal" to a player that publicly quit on them last year, and who also had the greatest three-year falloff of any RB in NFL history?
Because they lack depth at RB, and can use his diminished skills.


Oh, that's right, the same reason they are loyal to Ray Lewis who backstabbed his team and head coach,
And calls out the plays for the defense, and is one of the greatest in the history of the game to play his position. And is the face of the franchise, and could not have done more as a 'team player' during this past season.


and CMAC, who is simply an idiot.
Possibly the second best cornerback in the NFL.


And they cut loose AD?
They're not cutting him loose. It's called free agency.


Nice cap planning there.
Agreed. The team seems stable, and at many positions young, going into the future.


Next thing is we will be keeping a done Flynn and Mulatalo to keep Ogden happy. Sheesh.
How much do we save by cutting them? Do they not add depth? Are you sure they will be here?

[Gwaihir]

Nice Job Festivus !!

[festivus]

Nice Job Festivus !!

:toast:

[Khaine]

I second…


Err…

I mean third that. Nicely done Festivus.

[bassgtrst]

Looks like someone from the scout forum found a link to the forbidden city....


:laugh: Seinfeld fans??

[ravcol]

Ravcol responds: Glad everyone agrees...but..

Because they lack depth at RB, and can use Jamal's diminished skills.

By all means lets sign a guy with 'diminished skills'. Not many of them around..

And Ray Lewis calls out the plays for the defense, and is one of the greatest in the history of the game to play his position. And is the face of the franchise, and could not have done more as a 'team player' during this past season.

The Ravens defense improved immeasureably when Bart Scott took over
for an injured Ray Lewis in 2005. He is much cheaper and a quality guy. $3M in savings.

Possibly the second best cornerback in the NFL. (CMAC)

He's certainly the best when it comes to getting penalized. Is he worth that $8M cap figure? And what does that have to do with him being an idiot?

They're not cutting (AD) loose. It's called free agency.

They seemed to be able to re-sign Ogden, Lewis, Heap, Reed and McAlister. Now they won't sign a guy who is better than all of them and plays five positions to boot. (talk about cap savings)

How much do we save on Mulitalo and Flynn by cutting them? Do they not add depth? Are you sure they will be here?

Savings is about $4M..as for depth, Billick did a great job with his depth at RB. A premier 1000 yard rusher had 37 total carries when your number one sucked all year.

[festivus]

Because they lack depth at RB, and can use Jamal's diminished skills.

By all means lets sign a guy with 'diminished skills'. Not many of them around..
Ok. . . Who do you want to upgrade with, how much will you spend? I don't need Jamal back, but I have no problem resigning him at a salary commensurate with his skills. Do you?


And Ray Lewis calls out the plays for the defense, and is one of the greatest in the history of the game to play his position. And is the face of the franchise, and could not have done more as a 'team player' during this past season.

The Ravens defense improved immeasureably when Bart Scott took over
for an injured Ray Lewis in 2005. He is much cheaper and a quality guy. $3M in savings.
"Immeasurably"? Is that a number? Because statistically I am 100% certain our defense was markedly superior this year when Ray Lewis was in, compared to when he was out. Hopefully someone here who knows how to track that information down can come up with the magic number, but it's just a fact.


Possibly the second best cornerback in the NFL. (CMAC)

He's certainly the best when it comes to getting penalized. Is he worth that $8M cap figure? And what does that have to do with him being an idiot?
Nothing. He was not heavily penalized and had a career year this year, along with (finally) having a year staying out of the headlines.


They're not cutting (AD) loose. It's called free agency.

They seemed to be able to re-sign Ogden, Lewis, Heap, Reed and McAlister. Now they won't sign a guy who is better than all of them and plays five positions to boot. (talk about cap savings)
You are saying AD is better then Ed Reed, and better then Ray Lewis, and better then Chris McAlister, and better then Jonathan Ogden. In order of likelihood of making the HOF, I would say, (1) Lewis, (2) Ogden - both locks - (3) Reed, (4) McAlister - ranked closely - and AD does not make the list. No disrespect, he's good, but you have got to be kidding me. All four of those guys you mentioned are playing very well, and only one - Lewis - even *arguably* was not playing at the peak of his skills this past year.

Now I am beginning to understand that it is not Chris McAlister who is acting like an idiot.


How much do we save on Mulitalo and Flynn by cutting them? Do they not add depth? Are you sure they will be here?

Savings is about $4M..
Great. Then we need two more interior linemen. Perhaps they will be free?


as for depth, Billick did a great job with his depth at RB. A premier 1000 yard rusher had 37 total carries when your number one sucked all year.
Actually Fassel mixed it up pretty well, using a 3 RB system. It wasn't until Billick went to a *one* RB system, featuring a RB who "sucked all year," that our offense finally got better.

I feel like I am having an argument with someone who is stuck in the '06 off season. :brickwall:

[Rochardrik]

Ravcol responds: Glad everyone agrees...but..

Because they lack depth at RB, and can use Jamal's diminished skills.

By all means lets sign a guy with 'diminished skills'. Not many of them around..

And Ray Lewis calls out the plays for the defense, and is one of the greatest in the history of the game to play his position. And is the face of the franchise, and could not have done more as a 'team player' during this past season.

The Ravens defense improved immeasureably when Bart Scott took over
for an injured Ray Lewis in 2005. He is much cheaper and a quality guy. $3M in savings.

Possibly the second best cornerback in the NFL. (CMAC)

He's certainly the best when it comes to getting penalized. Is he worth that $8M cap figure? And what does that have to do with him being an idiot?

They're not cutting (AD) loose. It's called free agency.

They seemed to be able to re-sign Ogden, Lewis, Heap, Reed and McAlister. Now they won't sign a guy who is better than all of them and plays five positions to boot. (talk about cap savings)

How much do we save on Mulitalo and Flynn by cutting them? Do they not add depth? Are you sure they will be here?

Savings is about $4M..as for depth, Billick did a great job with his depth at RB. A premier 1000 yard rusher had 37 total carries when your number one sucked all year.

May I be the first to say... This is not fantasy football. We can't just sign who we want for what we want. :rolleyes:
There are 4 ufa running backs available this year, Jamal ranking # 1 on that list. Let's cut Cmac, and sign Who?
Ogden, Lewis, Heap, Reed, and CMac were re-signed when they were much younger, with more serviceable years left!
Defense ranked 5th or 6th in 2005, 1st in 2006... how does that make the defense better w/ Scott than Ray-Ray.
C'mon man, say something that makes sense, because none of this did!!!!

[ravcol]

He was not heavily penalized and had a career year this year, along with (finally) having a year staying out of the headlines.

One game he actually drew a flag from all 3 food groups--pass interference, illegal use of hands, and holding. He did cut down on the personal foul calls though, and averaged only one simultaneous chinstrap unbuckling per game..

You are saying AD is better then Ed Reed, and better then Ray Lewis, and better then Chris McAlister, and better then Jonathan Ogden. In order of likelihood of making the HOF, I would say, (1) Lewis, (2) Ogden - both locks - (3) Reed, (4) McAlister - ranked closely - and AD does not make the list. No disrespect, he's good, but you have got to be kidding me. All four of those guys you mentioned are playing very well, and only one - Lewis - even *arguably* was not playing at the peak of his skills this past year.

AD has been the best player on this team the past three years, with Ogden a close second. AD is better than Reed, Lewis and CMAC. He made All-Pro and plays five positions. Not talking who belongs in the HOF, I care about this year and the next five. Reed is one dimensional and uncoachable, Lewis is on his last legs and JO is as well. CMAC is, well, on a different planet.

Now I am beginning to understand that it is not Chris McAlister who is acting like an idiot.[/I][/B]

Waddaya mean acting...nobody's perfect...

[festivus]

AD has been the best player on this team the past three years, with Ogden a close second. AD is better than Reed, Lewis and CMAC. He made All-Pro and plays five positions. Not talking who belongs in the HOF, I care about this year and the next five.

Setting aside your completely inaccurate evaluation of these players relative to each other. . .

Don't misunderstand me. AD is very good as a LB/DE. That's what he plays, though he occasionally lined up elsewhere.

AD is *so* good, he deserves to get paid. He has done great for us in the years he's been here, so good he has blossomed into a player who deserves a big payday. Because of the timing, and because he plays a position at which we are relatively deep, he is going to cash in elsewhere, to get what he deserves.

It is not a poor reflection on the Ravens, on the contrary, I am pleased to see the Ravens could (a) find and (b) develop a 'diamond in the rough' like that.

Where you see a failure by the front office, I see another signal of their success at finding, signing, and developing talent.

How much do you want to sacrifice to keep one man?

[Khaine]

I would respond but Festivus is doing so well at saying what I would… but better – all by himself.

I’ll just watch in the wings. Get is… Ravens… wings… OK I’ll stop now. :p

[UKRavenStockers]

festivus, you're doing a great job schooling this guy but on CMac I have to disagree:

The 10 most penalised NFL players in yardage

McAlister, Chris Bal 122
Hobbs, Ellis NE 117
Rolle, Antrel Arz 107
Allen, Will D. Mia 101
Taylor, Sean Was 99
Incognito, Richie StL 95
Whitfield, Bob NYG 90
Trueblood, Jeremy TB 85
Wells, Reggie Arz 85
Tillman, Charles Chi 83

Those are the stats, as per usual CMac was heavily penalised this year and was not close to the 2nd best corner in the league this year I'd take the following above CMac without much question:

Bailey, Asomogha, Clements, Newman, Dunta Robinson, Asante Samuel.

That's not to say CMac isn't an upper tier corner in this league but he's not close to his very best in my opinion. He appears to have lost his top end speed that these guys all still have. At his best he was as good as Bailey and his run support is as good as there is in the NFL, but his top end speed and his closing speed removed him from the elite tier this season and the season before for my money.

NOTE: PacMan Jones would be in that group as well if he wasn't a complete idiot.

[Ravens0587]

Your list could be skewed, if Mcalister got a 65 or 70 yard PI penalty then that could account for most of it.

I think for you to say he isn't one of the elite is blasphemy

[festivus]

UK, normally your word is gold but I stand by my comment. Perhaps it's debatable but I saw a lot of those guys play this year and I'd take CMac over pretty much anyone but Champ Bailey.

[UKRavenStockers]

UK, normally your word is gold but I stand by my comment. Perhaps it's debatable but I saw a lot of those guys play this year and I'd take CMac over pretty much anyone but Champ Bailey.

That's fair enough and I can see the point of view but I just think that once you're up to a certain age your closing speed and deep speed goes and with the modern NFL I think the ability to run with anyone is vital and I think those guys edge it over CMac, they aren't gonna support the run or get in the WRs head like CMac might, but they can run with guys better than CMac IMO and with the bias to the WR at the moment I think that's more important right now.

Of those I listed, Bailey and Asomogha I'd definately, absolutely take over CMac this year. The others would be a toss up with me leaning towards all bar Clements, over CMac due to superior speed. With hindsight Clements wasn't that great this year, but he will apparently be the subject of a bidding war between the Redskins and the Giants this off-season.

[festivus]

I didn't mean to be short before, I was rushing.
1. CMac plays physical in his support of the run.
2. CMac, more then ever in his career, appears always to be in the right place at the right time.
3. Opposing qb's/oc's appear to avoid challenging him.
4. CMac has stopped acting like an idiot, notwithstanding ravcol's assertion to the contrary.

Really, I think 3 says it all. If I'm wrong about that, let me know. Champ Bailey ain't no spring chicken either, I don't think.

Whatcha gonna do with your .sig, UK? :)

[UKRavenStockers]

I didn't mean to be short before, I was rushing.
1. CMac plays physical in his support of the run.
2. CMac, more then ever in his career, appears always to be in the right place at the right time.
3. Opposing qb's/oc's appear to avoid challenging him.
4. CMac has stopped acting like an idiot, notwithstanding ravcol's assertion to the contrary.

Really, I think 3 says it all. If I'm wrong about that, let me know. Champ Bailey ain't no spring chicken either, I don't think.

Whatcha gonna do with your .sig, UK? :)

1. Totally agree, with Baxter's knees arsed and possibly never playing again (very sad about this) he's the best run support corner in the league along with Bailey and Ronde Barber for my money.
2. Most of the time, yes I agree but when he's not he's not got the ability to recover anymore IMO.
3. Very true though it's slightly augmented by playing opposite Rolle this year.
4. Totally agree, that stopped to my mind when Sanders signed for his second year I think. Turned up for the interview and has behaved like a teammate ever since.

Signature - No idea, I didn't make the sig, someone over at YBR made it for me, might keep it unless I can find someone to make a new one for me, he may have played his last as a Raven but he's still a legend. If I get it changed I'd look for something with Matt Stover in it.

[festivus]

Signature - No idea, I didn't make the sig, someone over at YBR made it for me, might keep it unless I can find someone to make a new one for me, he may have played his last as a Raven but he's still a legend. If I get it changed I'd look for something with Matt Stover in it.

Hell, keep it. I have Jermaine Lewis in my avatar. :toast:

[Dont Know]

Lewis has been waived (http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article.jsp?id=16744)